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Michelle Lanier: Today is Monday, February 9, 2015. This is Michelle Lanier interviewing Mr. Edward Stewart at his office place in Durham. How are you doing Mr. Stewart? Edward Stewart: Doing well, hope you are. Michelle Lanier: I am. Thank you. Do I have your permission to audio record this video for the Durham County Library. Edward Stewart: Yes.

00:00:24.600 - 00:04:17.280

Michelle Lanier: Wonderful. Well, as I shared with you before we started recording. We have some connections. Some of my family knew you and were connected to you here in Durham. And I have a wonderful list of questions from Ms. Lois DeLoach who does know you as well. We're going to start pretty broad. I would love to hear some of your early memories of being a child here in Durham. What are some of the earliest things you can remember about living in Durham. Edward Stewart: As I think back, I, I can think of a millions and millions of things. Ones that I might want to speak about would involve growing up in Durham. And around, at my time at Hillside High School and North Carolina Central University. Hillside was, of course, has the greater memories because I was just beginning to develop a relationship, well, relationships, though not a great athlete, I enjoyed participating in the sports at school and the other activities that would mould my development as a young man. And fortunately, the presence of North Carolina Central University here in Durham made it easy for me to continue my education upon graduation. Not on scholarship. I was going to play football, but I was injured in a automobile accident, the week of school opening. That cut short my attempt to be an athlete at North Carolina Central. I was, the coach then was Herman Riddick and he though never a great athlete at Hillside, because of my size he thought I'd be pretty good as an end on the Central's football team. But as I said, that never came to pass. But I enjoy the sports and have always, I think as soon as I was able to play, I always participated. To often, my dad, I would come home from, when I was a small kid, maybe in elementary school and middle school, too often I came home with clothes that were, when I left were neat and clean were raggedy and torn. So I had to develop a little discipline about when I played, how I played and what I wore. Michelle Lanier: So Mr. Stewart, would you share a little bit more with me about those earlier days. You said, sometimes your parents would send you to school in neat and clean clothes and you'd come back...so where were you in school and tell me a little bit more about your youth days. Edward Stewart: Well, I went to Pearson Town School in the first grade and then from Pearson Town I transferred to Whitted, James A. Whitted School and then later on after the, I think it was the 7^(th) grade, I was transferred to Hillside School. Hillside at the time was located on Corticoi Street, it's a vacant building. And Whitted School eventually became Hillside School and but I finished Hillside in 1947 and the, as I said earlier, I was fortunate to be able to continue my education at North Carolina Central, or then North Carolina College, and it was through the friendships and relationships and the teachers at North Carolina Central that really directed my path to that led to where I am now. Even though when I entered North Carolina Central, I entered with the idea of becoming a coach. Doing something in the field of athletics but after the automobile accident and not being able to participate in Central in the athletic arena, I changed my major to business, business administration, so I spent the next four years, three and a half years in Central, graduating in 1952. And upon graduation I was, I think a month later, inducted into the United States Army. I had received deferments for about three years but immediately once I received my college degree I received my letter of induction. And within about, I was inducted before Jackson, and I was shipped to Camp Gordon, Georgia, for, I was placed in the Signa Corp. It was my responsibility as a member of the Signa Corp to learn to decipher messages that might come in from the troops in various positions, needed various things from the Air Force. So I upon my training, completing my training at Camp Gordon, and incidentally, I was the only black person in this particular class of about 27 young men. I was also, the only who had a direct order to report to Korea after my, after my stay at home for about a week. This was during 1953 when the War, the Korean War was going on. So, traveling home and spending a week there and catching a plane to Washington State to Ft. Lewis in preparation for being shipped overseas. And I arrived overseas during the time of the war. I think the war ended about 6 months later. But, and I was assigned to a unit that was called Air/Ground Liaison Unit which served as a liaison between the army and the air force. Although I was in the army, it was my responsibility working in the communication center of the 5^(th) Air Force headquarters to receive and decipher messages from the fronts lines to the army officers in the center. This was about 6 months before. This lasted about 6 months before the war ended. And of course when the war ended, I was there for about another 10, 12 months, rebuilding that area of Korea in which I was stationed. It was quite an experience. I can tell anyone that the education in the army was worth the 4 years of education I had in college because of the travel, the exposure, the meeting of people and so forth. So I used the Army experience as further development of myself in deciding my professional life. So upon completion of my time in the army and my return back, my return to North Carolina, I re-entered Central in the grad school to continue my education. I found out that the jobs were not that available to me with just a, with just an undergraduate degree so because I had the benefits of having served in the army, I entered the North Carolina Central graduate school of business. And at the same time I was able to get some part time work at Durham Business College teaching business courses to young people and veterans. The young people who had just recently finished high school and the veterans returning from the service. I did that 3 years. I worked on my Master's Degree and somewhere along in there I met a lady in 1955. I was finishing up my, I had another year in graduate school and she was finishing up her undergraduate studies and we became attracted to each other and in 1955, I married. In 1956 we had our first child. A young lady, a beautiful baby by the name of Cheryl. Cheryl Stewart, and Cheryl is spelled C-H-E-R-Y-L. To often people spell her name S-H, so she quickly reminds them what the correct spelling of her name is. And I continue to teach school at the business college and then in 1958, I completed my course work for my masters and was offered a job at Liggen High School in Raleigh to teach. So I went to Raleigh, Liggen High School. There was a vacancy in the business department in the school at that time, and I joined the staff at that high school and I taught there for 7 years. '58-'65. When I became involved with what will be called the movement, it was, it was during that time there was a lot of civil rights activities going on in the city of Durham at that time. The North Carolina Fund had been funded to operate as a organization to address so many issues that promoted discrimination. So before leaving Liggen High School, my last year there, I was given the responsibility of developing the students to a point where they could be employed their senior year. So I started a program wherein the students were, I was assigned to direct the program, to run the program. Where students, senior students, would be in class, half, for half a day and then I would place them with some small business. Place them in a position with some small businesses in the city for the other half of the day. And we were quite successful. In fact there was a full page article done by News and Observer about the, about the program. Had pictures of the students in various positions. With hospitals, dry cleaners and so forth and so on. And that page, that full page blow up was seen by a friend of mine who had come to run a job training program and job development program called MITCE, that's manpower, I can't think of all of the, what the acronyms, the full name. But it was a program designed to work with low skilled or unskilled, unemployed persons in 6 counties. I was, the person who was the person who was the director of the overall phase of that program was a friend that I imagined when he saw this full blown up picture of some of the things we were doing at Liggen High School, he asked me if I would come and work for the North Carolina Fund. And amazingly, it was not a difficult decision because then with a master's degree, I think my salary at Liggen High School was around $8000. So I left and joined the North Carolina Fund's program called MITCE for the summer with the idea that I might go back to Liggen High School if I didn't like the work. But I got involved and I was, I had to...it was my responsibility to supervise 6 counties and those counties were Richmond, Robeson, Scotland, down in Fayeteville, NC, Wake and Edgecombe county, Nash and Edgecombe county, Rocky Mount and Tarboro way, and Craven county. Those 6 counties, we had programs set up, wherein people were going out to talk to unemployed people and try to encourage them to enter some kind of training and then we had job developers who would also talk to the businesses about hiring these people, and we had counselors to try to work with the people who were having difficulties in keeping those jobs. And also counselors to work with the employers who didn't quite understand that some of the problem was their problem, not the people. One interesting thing about this. We were supposed to identify ourselves with the unemployed persons. Sit and talk with them, have coffee with them and so forth, and one story, I don't believe this story. But one story was one lady was assigned to work with this young man who just could never get to work on Monday mornings because he lived by himself and he was a heavy drinker and he just couldn't make it to work on Monday. So this young lady was supposed to (inaudible) control his drinking, maybe even have a drink with him, but just give him some company so he would not drink too much and be in shape to work the next morning. Well, he improved. He got to the point where he stopped drinking, was going to work every morning, but we lost her. She started drinking. (laughs) So we had to reassign someone to work with her. That's, I don't know how true that is but...one of the workers that lived in that area told me about it. He declared that it was true. I hate to think that it would be true, but it could happen. But the important thing was that the things that we were doing, was get people back their dignity by giving them some training and then placing them in jobs. The better thing about all of this was that Craven County, and these small, Craven might be, I might consider one of the worst ones, but the discrimination was so heavy there in fact, I remember some peace workers who were standing, an integrated group standing in this vacant house and the Klan shot into the house on one occasion, and this is in Craven county area. But it was a job that was gratifying when we would see people smiling who had never smiled, had not smiled before because of their lack of food, clothing and proper shelter.I have gone in houses in Tarboro for instance where there was no floor, a partial floor, and little baby that was covered in flies. This is in Tarboro, North Carolina, America, the richest country in the world and these conditions were existing in Tarboro. And ths was in 19, I guess around 1961, '62 perhaps, no, '67, '68 perhaps. Because I left the North Carolina Fund to run a jobs training program at Operation Breakthrough which was at that time, a community action agency and I worked with that particular program for about a year and a half. And then I was asked if I would lead, if I would head up a program that was being developed by the Durham Business and Professional Chain. The Durham Business and Professional Chain is what we refer to the black business chamber of commerce at that time. And we had some strong people in that chain like Pete Allison, who's now passed. And Nathaniel White who has now passed. Very successful leaders. Dr., John Wheeler, who's of course a tremendous banker and great person within the community. These people were all a part of the Durham Business and Professional Chain. And I was asked to, they received some special fund from the administration, that they belonged to the national business league, they were a member of the national business league which is a membership of black organizations, business organizations around in various communities. And they had headquarters in Washington. And they had a tremendous leader called, and his name was Berkley Berrel. Berkely was a big republican and this was during, it was the Nixon administration, but he was able to get funds from the administration and disseminate it to 6 counties, cities, and their responsibility was to make loans available to small businesses to help them get started in business. The name of the program was Project Outreach, and I was asked to lead, to head up that particular program and as I said, there was 6 such programs in existence and I can Durham, Atlanta, Chicago, so forth, and I like to think that we did a tremendous job in bringing in, developing opportunities for small businesses. We worked in conjunction with the small business administration and after about a year and a half of that, I was asked to leave that job and go to the Manpower Development Corporation and, which was designed to research to improve relationships in communities on a nationwide basis. One thing that I specialized in doing while I was with that program was to sell a program, a sensitivity program. A sensitivity program, there was a guy, his name was Preston Kennedy. It was my job to go to major companies, particularly down east and so forth, up in the mountains, and encourage them...my job was to get an audience with the management of major companies, and encourage them to have their top workers, administrative staff to go through a program of sensitivity. It was a hard sell, but we had quite a few companies that were willing to go through that experience. And Preston was, he's passed now, Preston as a masterful person in delivering such a program. I know one company, did not want, it was difficult to get in, but he finally opened the door for Preston to come in at mid management. Preston did such a great job, he had his entire administrative staff to go through the process. And I remember one meeting, one pre-meeting we had when he was talking to, Preston was talking to the president and some of his top staff. We were in this church and this church had, served as a day care for kids. And Preston brought all of the participants over the window. These kids were out there playing in the yard, black, white and Indians and Preston said, asked them to look down in the yard. He said, “you see what I see? Those kids are having a great time with each other. They don't have any problems with each other.” And he turned around and said, “The problem is in the room, is in this room.” And that, it was amazing. I don't think the participants seen, they had perhaps seen but not realized such a fact. Well that was another company that Preston went through to top management to help them to identify those constitutional, institutional discriminatory feelings that they had, that had been institutionalized in their system of being as well as in that community. Anyway, I enjoyed doing that. I enjoyed doing that. Well look you might thing with all these jobs, that I'm moving around, but I'd like to add that I was requested, I was asked to assume the leadership of these jobs and then finally, I was asked again, to come to this particular job. The job I currently have in 1970. A friend of mine, Nathan Garrett, who himself was involved with the North Carolina Fund and was involved with delivery, delivering programs and conducting activities to address the, the conditions of black folks who were placed in their position because of their color. And Nathan who was head of a program called the foundation...he had been the vice president of the North Carolina Fund, and then he left the fund and started another organization called the Foundation for Community Development. I hope these notes are right in my head. And out of that foundation, he became aware of funds that were available for special projects and they needed a development company to receive those funds. So he pulled together United Durham Incorporated and United Durham was the recipient of some funds from the Office of Community Services. I think at that time was called the Office of Economic Opportunity, OEO. That was in 1970. I was asked to lead the program. Now the first big dollars had already been granted to the organization and they were dollars to start a modularl housing (inaudible) and a small supermarket. In 1970, the program had not been with a leader, a direct leader and I was asked to come in and serve as the Executive Director. I and another person, we were both asked and the funny thing about, well, not funny, the other guy elected, his name was Lindsay Murray, he's passed now, a good friend of mine, but he was selected to run, but Lindsay decided that he was at the time working at North Carolina Central and he decided it wasn't quite enough security for he and his family so he backed out and then I was told you had it. I accepted the position and the first two projects we were working on failed within a years time. The marginal housing plan and the supermarket, it was a small market, only about 7500 square feet. But it failed for various reasons. Although they did some good things. We trained a lot of people. We built modular affordable housing across North Carolina, up in the mountains. We even built 4 unites and created a day care center for the Atlanta University consortium of, of March Brown, Clark College and so forth. And there were a number of homes, about 60 or 70 homes located throughout Durham. There's one street, a few blocks from here that has a row of houses that we built. And we trained people and which allowed them to get jobs they were not able to get before and so forth. But the project itself still failed. But fortunately for me, at the same time that these two projects were failing, I had been negotiating for a grant of a million dollars from the federal government. At the same time these two projects were failing the grant was announced. And the grant was to bring sewer services a mile out into this development here. Where we sit right now. You are now in UDI industrial park, which represents, it represents 91 acres of development that started out with 16 acres and it, because of its proximity to the Research Triangle Park, it was almost an immediate success by way of companies who were wanting to move into the area but did not have the sophistication or the money to be in the Research Triangle Park but wanted to be near the Park. There are quite a few companies in the Park, currently in the Park because of that. But what went wrong with all of this is that when we started the park, the industrial park, it was to be a place for black entrepreneurs and developers. That was the original concept that Nathan Garrett and his team had. And I traveled to Texas, Philadelphia, I got a frat brother in Philadelphia. His brother had a company there we wanted badly to get to, not relocate, we wanted them to expand. See you don't want to take jobs from one community for another one. We looked at those companies that had such a successful track record that they could expand Well, and we would bring them here, and the North Carolina Mutual and the Chamber of Commerce would entertain them, and try to convince them that this is the place to go, to come. Well, there were reasons, various reasons, they had good reason I suppose as to why they could not. At the same time, doing this, we were running out of money. The Chamber of Commerce, there was a guy at the Chamber of Commerce, his name was Jim Camp. He passed now, he was. Jim Camp was a good football player at the University of North Carolina. But Jim took me under his wings and took me around to meet people in state government and so forth, and the was the recruiter for the Chamber of Commerce. And while he was bringing people, showing them other tracts of land, here in Durham and Research Triangle Park, he would bring them by here. Now we only had, we had, construction was under way. They were extending sewer services and were building a building. The first building that are in the pictures on the wall up there. And these companies that he was, that he was showing around were eager to locate in this tract of land, in this industrial park. So the first company was a company from Poughkeepsie, New York that was making circuit boards for IBM. And that was the start of the industrial park, which now at one time was...where we are sitting now was a hog pit, and I hope I changed the aroma. (laughs)But what is, what was then nothing but, country roads and one country road and a lot of waste land, you know, no sewer services or anything, is now an industrial park of 91 acres and you got about 450/500 people coming to work everyday. We don't own, half of this property we have sold as part of our development expenses, but we control, we still control them through our covenants. In fact another company cannot sell. A company that has sold, that has purchased land from us within the park, cannot sell to another company unless we approve to whom he sells. Because we want to make sure there the companies that locate here will bring a certain quality and will conduct their business in a certain fashion that we think is proper to make sure there's no discrimination, make sure there's not hazardous waste and that kind of a thing in the area. So we're very pleased. The park is built up now. We completing, I think the last available tract of land is currently under preparation. Last year we received a major grant to start a (Equiponic?) project. And so we are currently, I passed the site today. The guys are planting the products. We should be harvesting sometime toward the end of March. But the idea is to have an urban farm, whereby we are going to be producing and growing fish. If you like Tilapia and so forth, we are going to be running fish in an urban setting as well as vegetables. And the idea is healthy foods and of course create some jobs, create some additional jobs in this community. It's going to be a unique project. It's going to be something different and we are pretty excited about the potential of it. And we are currently, if you look around the wall, well, you will see if I can. Can I get up and walk over there? If these pictures you are looking at are any indications of, and there are about 12 or 15 of them. In the case of some of the projects, what you are looking at right now to my, on the right side is the supermarket. The supermarket is, the Food Lion supermarket is, that was the facility that was constructed about 10 years ago on Fayetteville Street. It started out as a project with a lady's organization, the AKA's. But that's where we got the idea. But it evolved as a, with UDI purchasing a building that was one time a Winn Dixie's supermarket and we purchased the site and rebuilt, redeveloped the area and were fortunate that Food Lion became one of the tenants in the building. The police department became the other tenant. This created an atmosphere, improved an atmosphere in that community that at one time had been filled with, you could hear gun shots at any time of night and it also encouraged the other property owners to spruce up their properties. That environment has changed 150% just because of the movement of bringing that supermarket into that area at the corner of Fayetteville Street and Pilot Street. 3 miles south to North Carolina Central. It has North Carolina Central's decorum, maroon and gray. In fact, the Chancellor at that time James Hammond at the time joined me and Bill Bell who is the vice president here, joined us in cutting the ribbon for that supermarket. And of course, the building, the picture on the left of the supermarket, the resource center, that is what we are currently in the process of trying to redevelop. Our idea is to revitalize that particular building to create space for small businesses and perhaps an incubation program. We're not certain. But the idea is to create that so that it will enhance the area by way of atmosphere and so forth. And right across the street from that we have just constructed a 3 level building that will serve, the first floor is available for commercial activities. The second floor will have, has 2 offices, we are hoping to lease that to 2 attorneys. The third floor is a 2 bedroom condo that is occupied. Those are the kinds of projects, one that is most notable to us that does not bring a lot of dollars to us, but it provides, it's a major, I think a major, creates a major impact in the community is that if you pass St. Joseph's church going up Fayetteville Street toward North Carolina Central, if you look beyond, or behind St. Joseph's church, you'll see a 3 story brick building. It's very visible from Fayetteville Street. It was built with the help of some funds from HUD to be an elderly center for low income people. We built that, we were fortunate to get fund whereby it is a no cost to us development. And it has 32 units and we have a waiting list and it is beautiful. The tenants there are so proud of their room, it looks like, they have rooms, I haven't seen anything in magazines that might surpass what some of the rooms look like. And we try to conduct program that help them to enjoy their remaining years of livelihood. I guess about the most, if you asked me what the most exciting thing is, it would be difficult to say because I think my joy is in the development that has taken place and created jobs that hopefully has, and that is our mission. Create jobs that will help improve the livelihood of people from low income status.

00:42:59.660 - 00:44:07.750

Michelle Lanier: Thank you so much for that wonderful journey. It's been so inspirational for me to hear this. I do have some follow up questions that I think what I'll do is kind of go back, let's loop back around and see about filling in some details. Would you mind telling me about, now where your parents from Durham? Edward Stewart: My parents were from Apex, Raeford in that area. Michelle Lanier: What brought them to Durham? Edward Stewart: I, my mother's granddaddy was a farmer in Apex. And I don't know how my daddy met her, my mother. But I can't go back any further than Enterprise Street. That's where I remember walking to Pearson Town School. I've never discussed how they met or anything of that nature. They're both passed now.

00:44:07.750 - 00:44:52.270

Michelle Lanier: And what were their professions in Durham? Edward Stewart: Well my mother she just did, she washed clothes for white folks and they brought them to the house and she washed them. If they had know that she was washing mine along with theirs, they might not have brought them there. But anyway, my daddy worked at Ligget and Myers tobacco company all of his life. Michelle Lanier: What did your dad do at Ligget and Myers? Edward Stewart: He was in the shipping department and he could read and that put him a position to monitor items coming in and going out of the company. He stayed on the dock. I remember when I would need a dollar, I could leave school and run up there without going through, not going into the building, begging to him, let me have a dollar. Sometimes he did, sometimes he didn't. (laughs) But he lived there until it was time for him to retire at age 75, I think it was. Even though, yeah 75. He passed at age 86.

00:45:25.870 - 00:48:12.660

Michelle Lanier: And do you remember what it looked like as a child. Do you remember going to any of the auctions or any of that as a child when this was such a tobacco town? Edward Stewart: No, it was such a smelly place, smelly. I had no idea, no interest in going to auctions. I hate it. Now I have one thing I skipped. I hate, I worked at Liggett and Myers at one time. I worked there, I was out of college, at the tine I was in college in the quarter system, three quarters. I was out the first quarter of my second year and I went to work at Liggett and Myers. And I couldn't stand it. I worked 2 weeks and I had to quit. I was back in school and that was the best lesson I guess I could ever receive to tell me to go back to school. So I quit after the second week. And soon as the second quarter was available for me to enter I was back in college. Michelle Lanier: What were you doing at Liggett and Myers that you disliked... Edward Stewart: Here's what I was doing. I was with the Hargett game. And the Hargett game was moving big barrels of tobacco around from building to building and that sort of thing. The barrels of tobacco would roll off the truck, down the alleyway toward you, for you to have, you had a big oak stick that you would stick underneath that barrel. That barrel was supposed to roll up on that stick and as it rolls up on that stick, you're supposed to kick it around so it will go in the direction you want it to go. That barrel pinned me in a corner one time. But more, even greater than that, I worked at the American Tobacco Company too on a different occasion. And this is also during this time of my life the, out of college, that quarter. And I worked there for 10 days. I was on a gang, there were 3 of us. We were delivering tobacco. Tobacco was coming out of this hot oven, on a stick, that was tied together on one end and across a stick. And as it rolled to you, it rolled very slowly. As it rolls to you and as there are 2 men, there are 2 machines there. 3 guys working 2 machines. One guy's resting while the other 2 work then he ties, then he takes place of one of the guys. That's the kind of work we were doing. You had to get some rest. You couldn't just work continuously. So we had a third guy come in a rest you, then while you rest, and after a while you go rest and the other guy...that tobacco would come out of that oven and you were to grab it on a stick on one end, raise it up and take your other hand and push the tobacco down to the end. All the tobacco down to the end then raise the stick with all the tobacco pushed down to the end and give it to the guy that was in a barrel and he would take that tobacco, like he was, he would hug it and then he would drop it in this barrel and he had some planks that he would stand on and keep pushing that tobacco down, ok. That tobacco, you did this in what was called the green season. I vomited all over the floor one time. I couldn't, it was terrible. And the pay, but again, I did that for 10 days.

00:49:12.800 - 00:50:33.900

Michelle Lanier: Did you say you threw up on the floor? Edward Stewart: Yes. Michelle Lanier: Why? Edward Stewart: The scent from that tobacco. You have to eat a big meal. See at lunch time there were some people across the street from the American Tobacco. There were some people that lived across the street. Some black people. And the ladies over there, they would have these hot meals that you could go and pay, I think 20 cents or 25 cents. Neck bones, collard greens, and that's what you had to eat so you could go back across the street and stomach that stench from that tobacco. Well, I didn't eat. I missed lunch one day, and so what little I had in me, decided to come up. Yeah. Those were the experiences that made me realize there has to be a better way and I've just got to find that better way.

00:50:33.900 - 00:50:48.500

Michelle Lanier: I forgot to ask you, what were your parents names? Edward Stewart: Richmond, my father Richmond (Inaudible) and that's why I'm Richmond Edward and my mother, Novella, we called her Ray. Michelle Lanier: Do you remember, did you see your parents face any discrimination in the kinds work they did? They must have been exposed to some of the Jim Crow practices of the time. Edward Stewart: Well, I'm sure that my job did. I guess one of the most (sighs) terrible things that I saw, one night about 2 o'clock or so in the morning. Now I'm about 6 or 7 years old. My sister, I had 2 sisters. They're twins. And they're 2 years older. We're at the house. Here comes this Bam on the door. Here comes 2 white cops and they were looking for a guy, 2 doors down from me was a liquor house. 2 or 3 doors, 2 doors from me was a liquor house. Very popular. They were raided whenever they felt like it but they were raided whenever they felt there was a need to do so, but the guy's name was Dick Tucker. And Dick would pay them off and so forth. There were some, you know dangerous, not dangerous...there were some guys that hung around there. They were kind of troublesome. And so one night they were looking for this guy. So here come these 2 cops bamming on the door. They, before my daddy could get to the door, they had pushed the door open, and walked into the house, walking right by him, right in the bedroom. My mother was in the bed, that kind of thing. Looking under the bed, looking. There was no respect at all but you know...of course the guy wasn't who they were looking for wasn't there and then they walked out. And after turning over a few chairs and then just walked out and left, nothing said, nothing done. I'll never forget that picture. But that was about the only time I can recall my father having to experience discrimination. Since I wasn't with him on the job, but I know he was with the black group in that section of the job where they, I knew he went through it.

00:53:04.860 - 00:54:59.740

Michelle Lanier: I wanted to also hear, was your family active in any of the local churches? Did you all attend? Edward Stewart: My daddy helped to build Oak Grove Free Will Baptist Church, which is located on Colfax Street. He was in choir. He was superintendent of schools, he led the choir. He had 2 choirs. One was a man's choir and he taught sunday school. He was very active there. We would go to church for sunday school. I would stay there, go back for what was called Young People's Christian league. And then go back. We had a 7 o'clock service. That was Oak Grove Free Will Baptist on Colfax Street. Then he left there and helped to build another church. I can't think of the street, that was a few block, it was pastored by a Reverend Z.D. Harris who died just recently a few months ago. But, in fact they have a picture of him in the vestibule of that church. So he was very active in the church. My mother attended of course. She did her role with the mother of the church and that kind of thing, yeah. Michelle Lanier: Thank you and and do you have memories of certain people that stand out for you with that church community? Edward Stewart: In the church community? Not really, not really. I, you know, I met a lot of people, but it wasn't anyone, I rather think about those persons who I had a relationship with under various conditions. Like John Hope Franklin. He, it so happened that, I'm in an organization called The Bolet (?) (?) So was John Hope. In fact my interest in getting in that organization, can you imagine sitting down in an organization. We have lectures and the lecturers of course select a talk of their choosing, but whatever John Hope wanted to talk about, Leroy Walker, Dr. Charlie Watts, these people like Julius Chambers, these people were all members of that group. My interest in becoming a member, and I was sponsored by Nathan Garrett to become a member. My reason for becoming, was to hear the lectures of these guys, that you would pay dollars to hear, that you'd hear, maybe if you'd hear them otherwise. So that group, I like to refer to, as, and my time here I served, I've been fortunate to serve on the University, North Carolina Central University. I think I served a total of 12 years as a board member. In fact I was elected as a board member Emirates a couple of years ago. And so my exposure there, my intellectual exposure there was additional education. See I got my doctorate degree, even though it is not bestowed upon me because of the experiences I've had with people of such learned position, learned persons. So I like to think about those in reference to...and to tell you the truth, one of the greatest persons I know was John Wheeler who was a tremendous person in the business world and in the political world. People just don't know what he did as a political person.

00:57:02.540 - 01:00:40.760

Michelle Lanier: I would love to hear you talk more about some of these gentleman. I'm thinking particularly about John Wheeler. And I heard you talk about the Durham Business and Professional Chain and so I'd love to hear you talk more about John Wheeler and any of the other gentleman in that organization, and perhaps we can go from there and hear more about these Durham luminaries. Edward Stewart: Well, I mentioned John Wheeler. I mentioned John Hope Franklin and Julius Chambers. I was chairman of the board, I was on the board at least when Julius Chambers, he's one of the smartest men also that I know. He, well he's passed now but the Nat White was, he had a service printing company, but he was a guy who during our demonstrations, and the marches that we had back in the 60s. You see there was a boycott of downtown Durham for about 8 months. It was an effective boycott and it was, so what I did was develop a bridge between the black community and the white community. And so the decision was made by black and white leaders to let's have certain people in the black community continue to talk to people in the white community, while this boycott is going on. So it's people like Nat White and Pete Allison and John Wheeler particularly and some others. I was not in that group, but I was sitting in the meetings as they were preparing themselves to meet the white reps, representatives. I know what it took to, those were very trying times. And it took them strength to march and stand before...I remember Howard Fuller for instance. Now Howard was, they said he was a radical person, but Howard was a tremendous person. Howard Fuller was the one that led the march. He was on the other side, but he still had the confidence of John Wheeler. He was on the side, he was doing. He was the rabble rouser. He was throwing rocks, bricks, could have said some other things, but time might not have...but Howard was our leader. Violence was not what he pushed, but violence was what he didn't mind being a part of, if it was going to bring some justice. Walking, you know marching up and down streets at night. It's not an easy thing to do when someone could be sitting on the roof with a rifle. And there's a picture... Michelle Lanier: What time period is this? Edward Stewart: It had to be, I was with the Fund. It had to be 19, it had to be something like 19 oh 69' maybe, something like that '68, '69. I left the Fund and go through...um, I left Manpower Development Corporation to come to UDI in 1970. Had to be the late 60s. And those times were very, very trying times. And I remember the strength that Howard Fuller had when we were standing before the Chamber of Commerce. They were operating, they were meeting in a building on Murray Street at that time. And Howard, we were all in a room, standing before them and so it was, they said, we will now hear from Howard, the speaker, representing this group. And Howard stepped forward and said, there was a city councilman named Biggs. I remember this so well, who had his back, he turned his chair around when the group stood up. And Howard said, I ain't going to say one damn thing until that man turn around. And of course he grudgingly turned around and we, Howard was our spokesman to just say we are tired of this discrimination (inaudible)other things. He was a man of many words. You know he left here when on to become superintendent of schools in Milwaukee. And he's, I got his book, and he came here for his book signing I don't know, a few months ago. I have a copy of, but during the 85 years, you know, you look at the educators you were exposed to, you look at the activists you've been exposed to. You look at the people, who have not been so fortunate that you work with. That's a lot that made you grow to be whatever it is that you are.

01:03:12.610 - 01:05:32.330

Michelle Lanier: I heard you mention that you had a frat brother that you were working with to potentially recruit a business to UDI. Would you share about the civic organizations and fraternal organizations that you are a part of. Edward Stewart: Well, I'm a Kappa and I'm a member of the Boule, (inaudible) Boule. I'm a guardsman and the guardsman, I don't know if you've been with them or not. They are a group of men who, we don't have an agenda. We, and most of these same men who are guardsmen are also in the Boule, but it was decided one day by a group of people let's just have an organization. We've got all these organizations doing this, doing this, doing this, forever busy. We can't leave our office without getting involved in some other activities, let's have an organization that we have nothing but fun. And golfing and swimming activities of a physical nature is part of what we do and enjoy each other. Alright, I've been on the board of St. Joseph's Historic Center, board member emeritus of that. Of the North Carolina Institute for Minority Economic Development. A number of organizations that have been very significant in economic achievement for black folks in this community. Michelle Lanier: So I heard that you said there were several people who have been very impactful in terms of your route, your professional route. You've mentioned Nathan Garrett, you mentioned Jim Camp. Are there other people you felt perhaps were inspirations or helpful along the way in your development. Edward Stewart: Well, of course. UDI for instance. Well let me go back even further then that. J.W. Hill, who was then head of the Durham Business College.

01:05:32.750 - 01:08:44.800

Michelle Lanier: What's the last name again? Edward Stewart: J.W. Hill, H-I-L-L. Incidentally his wife is being buried Wednesday, she died Sunday. Goes to my church. But he was my mentor when I taught at Durham Business College. I was in grad school. Then I look at of course, Nathan Garrett who is just a tremendous friend. And of course working with the North Carolina Fund, he has a certain quietness and quality of action that people can immediately spot. You might not see it immediately, but you will see it before the day is over. And he's going to say that significant thing that's very important. And of course I can, I guess every professor at Central. I've had the privilege of being involved with every president or head of North Carolina Central University since its inception. That includes Shepard. See I was a freshman in 1947, and that's the year Shepard died, ok. And then I was a student, I was either a student or active in the university under every president that has been there. And of course, you got to develop something from that relationship. And over 85 years I've had some good ministerial relationships with some of the preachers here in the community. I guess I spent most time with Phillip Cousin before he left St. Joseph's AME Church. I was a trustee there at the church, just before he left. Well, I resigned just before he left. I started stepping back a few years ago and that was one thing that I stepped back from. The experiences, it is difficult for me to, I guess after you leave and tonight later on, a lot of things will come to mind. Well, one thing I did want to ask you. You mentioned meeting your wife at Central. Do you care to say her name for posterity? Edward Stewart: Her name is Eunice Etheridge from Nashville, North Carolina. She was just changing class and I at the time was in grad school and she was in her senior year. And when classes were changing, I was in the business department, I'd come to the door just to see the ladies go down the hallway, and she was fascinating. Our eyes just caught each other and without saying anything, the next day, and the next day until finally there was an occasion for us to talk and then you know, next thing, go to a movie.

01:09:19.350 - 01:11:07.770

Michelle Lanier: Do you have memories of when their black owned movie houses in Durham? Edward Stewart: Oh yes, I'm glad you mentioned that. See I walked to the Carolina Theater. I was crazy. I walked up those steps. There was a good movie I wanted to see. I went up those steps at the Carolina Theater. I don't recall how many, but I know it was terrible. Yeah, I traveled up those steps, many, many times. One of the things that made it exciting that's you also used the movie theater at that time as a place to, I don't know, cuddle up as well. So other than that, going up those steps was something that was so terrible, and the waiting. They had a large room in there where could serve, the intent was for it to serve as a place for people to sit and talk but it was nothing but a raggedy old, raggedy chairs. There was no decency in what was going on at the Carolina Theater back in those days. Michelle Lanier: So what you are talking about is the segregated... Edward Stewart: The segregated section of the hotel, I mean of the movie theater. I remember, I worked when, during my time at Central, my second year I think, I was working at a jewelry store in town after I left class, and I, I was asked by the wife of the store owner to go pick up her son. He was at the...a little boy about then around 10. He was at the theater, Carolina Theater. So I went and run in the door and this lady ran out. I saw her run out and run to talk to a man standing there. Then they both came, but I just went on to where the kid was. I knew where he was supposed to be seated. I went around and grabbed him by the arm and then walking out the door. They were standing. They didn't know what to do. They were standing. They didn't know whether I was legitimate. They didn't know what to do. And it didn't stir up me, I felt, until later on. I said, I bet she was all alarmed because he comes the black man into this Carolina Theater. This is in the main, this is on the first floor and so forth. That's when it hit me mostly. And of course.

01:12:12.030 - 01:16:20.250

Michelle Lanier: Because the child was white? Edward Stewart: Because the child was white and then they saw me. I'd had him by his hand, just walking with him. The store was on Main Street which is about 2 blocks from where the theater is. So we were just walking back on the street to the store. I can remember so many times wherein, the bus driver is one. The time I was staying in MacDougal Terrace. I, my wife and I, she'd just moved here from Washington. When she finished school, she went to Washington to work with the government. It was later on, a few months later that we got married. And then she moved here after she became pregnant and I remember we were trying to catch the bus and I was in front of her. I ran in front of ther and got on the bus and she was coming down the walkway trying to get there. The bus driver looked at her and just seemed like he just put the, mashed on the gas. I got off the next stop, but it was that kind of evil and meanness that white folks had, that I experienced. You know and being told that you can't sit here and you got to move back here. I was told that move back in the bus. And I got up to move back, because the bus was crowded in the front, there were vacancies in the back, so black folks just you got to move back a seat or two now so white folks can sit down. I have experienced that. I was on a plane in the army en route to Korea. We stopped at the airport, I think it was in Oregon. We stopped at the airport and I went in the store, went in the door. It was snowing like heck and we got off the plane for just briefly and I was told I couldn't go into the store. I was just trailing the other passengers on the plane. And the same thing happened to me in South Carolina. I'm riding with some white boys. There are 4 of us, I'm the only black. We were riding from North Caro...from Fort Jackson. I was at Fort Jackson then. Riding from Fort Jackson to Durham and we stopped and I went in with everybody else and I was told that I had to go out and you know, one of the boys, one of the other guys came out with me and I was on what was called Bitwac...that's training, you're being trained in a similar exposure as, as if you were in active war. And during a lull, me and another guy were asked to drive the jeep in town and wash them, then bring them back. So we did that, down there and washed the jeeps and we did this at the base. Saw a barbershop, I said I'll go over there and get my hair cut. I went over there and asked the guy, told the guy I wanted a haircut. He had (inaudible) and he said, yeah, come on in. I'm gonna cut your hair. I got in my jeep, me and my buddy got into my jeep and went on back to camp. Michelle Lanier: So I want to respect your time and wrap up, but at what point do you feel compelled to join what you called earlier “The Movement?”

01:16:22.310 - 01:21:48.990

Edward Stewart: Oh, that was easy, that was very easy. See from, again, from early childhood, you know the schools i've gone through, I've gone too downtown, here in Durham, even if I had not done a lot of traveling before I went into the army, but what little traveling I had done, that, all those things were made easy to get into, to join someone else. Where there might be some strength. One person doing something is not going to do much, not going to get very much done. But when you've got a group and they're doing, they've got the same objectives. They've joined hands and are doing this together, it makes you feel comfortable. Here's a chance to show your frustrations and that's, that was my chance. I was remembering some of the harsh treatments, I know my mother went through, and I, that'd I'd been through. It was easy. I remember setting pins up at a bowling alley down in Durham and pins, I wasn't setting the pins fast enough. This is when, now they have automatic, automatic pins, but then we had some black guys in this bowling alley. We'd set the pins and then move aside and the guy was a little teed off with me and he rolled the bowl down before I could even get off the alley, and that kind of a thing. The, I think I got in several fights, but I'm so glad that they were clean fights. They were not, they were not fights with violence, with knives or anything of that nature. Michelle Lanier: What year did you start joining organized resistance to racial oppression? Edward Stewart: As soon as the opportunity came, well as soon as I became aware that there was a movement on, there was an immediate step to be a part of that movement. That was in 19...I was then in, I'd joined, that was right before I joined the Fund, the North Carolina Fund. So it had to be, I left teaching in '50, in '65, so it had to be, like '65, '66. That's when I came to work for this organization, The North Carolina Fund. But the Fund itself was an active movement against discrimination. That's what the whole thing about the North Carolina...The Fund was to do a lot of things. But what it had were a lot of activists, in just about every corner, black and white and Indians. 1/3 black, 1/3 white, 1/3 Indians. I remember we were in Goldsboro. We, black, white and Indians, we met over the weekend at this hotel. It was a Holiday Inn and up on the corner from the Holiday Inn was a service station. And we met like Friday, Saturday, Sunday. We came on that Sunday, just sitting around that pool. Nobody was swimming. In fact, I don't think it was cool, warm enough for swim. But we were just sitting around in the sun and after a while here comes a rock. Here comes a lot of yelling and there's a bunch of white folks that gathered up at the service station. I guess the distance might be from about a couple of hundred yards. And so we picked up the rocks and threw them back. And threw back the balls, and so forth. But immediately, people with sounder minds had called the police. The police came out and they patrolled the area. I had a buddy there that was an attorney. I called him. He's very active (inaudible) Whitted was his name. I called him, he came out to give some comfort, whatever comfort I told him to be careful he didn't get hit in the dark as you go back home. But anyway, those kinds of things made me all the more eager, and made me stronger in what I was trying to, and the efforts we were exerting and trying to bring some recognition to to our cause and to our being. Michelle Lanier: So I want to end by asking you, what's the most important thing for you right now when it comes to your, your personal investment in Durham. You've invested a lot of your time and work in Durham in a volunteer way and in a professional way. What's really important to you right now?

01:21:51.970 - 01:25:37.650

Edward Stewart: We've started a, this project with the Acuponic project and we got an empty building, well partially empty that we just constructed. I want to make sure that these two projects come to fruition right now. They are, they represent, the building is located in what is called North East Central Durham, which is one of your more depressed communities in Durham. And we've done a lot of work over there. In addition to that building that you see on the wall over there. In addition to that... Michelle Lanier: What's the address of that? Edward Stewart: That's 800 North Magnum Street. In addition to that, and the houses across the street from it, in (inaudible) we build houses over there and the project about 50 yards up the street, north of that place and 2 streets over, Glendale Avenue, we build 16 houses. So that area has been, we've, this industrial park and that area, we have given a lot of attention. And so this 3 story building that we, it's small. Got a footprint of only about 1200 square feet. It was supposed to be twice the size it is now, 3 times the size, but partner who was going to join us backed out of the deal, so we decided to just go ahead and build a smaller project. So a 3 level building, but the whole idea is that it served as a catalyst for upgrading that entire block. My next move is with city. The people in economic development division. We've been talking to them. Now they helped with this building. They gave me a $100,000 to cover some of the costs of this building. Well the whole idea again is to let that building be a catalyst for revitalization for the rest of that block. That's what, that's what I see as a major, major project for us. And then right across the street, we have a 25,000 square food building. But that building, the whole idea again of that building. The idea is to demolish a portion of it. Demolish it, demolish that building and redevelop it with affordable housing and some commercial stuff. That's about 2 years from now, but we are meeting, we are meeting with developers. Hopefully they will bring the finances that will allow us to do that. That will upgrade, be a major factor in changing the environment. It's already improved quite a bit. So I don't know. There are so many things I would like to see come to fruition and that we're involved in. I can't, I can't pinpoint one thing or the other. Michelle Lanier: Well, that's a great way to end, with a nod toward the future. I have appreciated your time and your leadership in multiple aspects of Durham, and the state and nation. If there's anything you'd like to add, feel free, but otherwise I just thank you for the interview.

01:25:44.270 - 01:26:08.050

Edward Stewart: No, I we talked, and as you can see I have a lot of passion in what I'm doing. And something I enjoy talking about because I've lived it. Sure, I'm not modest, I like to share it with the others. So thanks for the interview. Michelle Lanier: Thanks for sharing it, thanks for living it. End interview at